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Would this famous logo be a victim of the new law?
This is ridiculous. Should the USA be banned from using the eagle as a symbol because the Nazis used it? Of course not. Why should Hindus, Buddhists and Jayans be banned from using the swastika
The ban on the swastika is indeed very absurd. It only shows the ignorance of some people.
Of course, the nazi-swastika represents hatred, and is offensive to many people. But that may not be an excuse to outlaw a symbol of luck, that is thousand of years old.
I think the world is getting totally absurd, by the way. Only last week, a theological convention in saudi-Arabia proposed to outlow the letter X, because it has to much similarities with the cross of the christians.
How stupid can some people get ?
“Missuse by the nazis”; noone has a copyright or anything on such a symbol, and the nazis found something that they liked and that gave their regime a concrete and unmistakable symbol to flag with, from their point of view, perfect.
The nazi regime is however long gone now, but the symbol persists with a different meaning in different cultures, associate it with what you want!
If people stopped being so god damn negative about everything, then the so called neo nazis would probably change symbol to something else, and someone else would start complaining. Since there’s something called free speech, there ain’t no point trying to fight nazism or nazi-wise use of the swastika all day long, so let’s all get together and make a brand new symbol for ‘em to use until they eventually drop their beliefs.
It is really shocking to see how ignorance strikes, once again, this time in Germany.
I feel I’d like to propose to ban Germans… Why not? And ban the cross also, since I was used by ku klux klan…
Hi Louise,
Thanks for posting.
I would say that it sounds wonderful for a child to associate the swastika with its spiritual meaning right from the start.
The day will come when he will be confronted with the knowledge that the symbol has been abused by some people – and used for terrible actions. This may be confusing and upsetting to him, but I think it would be better to have the original, positive understanding first and then learn about the negatives later… rather than starting off with the negative and then trying to understand the positive later.
I can imagine that it might be confusing to friends and relatives if he was to start doodling swastikas out of nursery. But I guess that this would be a good opportunity to teach others about the swastika too…
I would like your thoughts please…
I have just collected my son from nursery, he is almost three years old. The children at nursery have been drawing swastika’s and learning about its spiritual meaning.
My concerns are that at such a young age, my son can not understand the meaning that the swatskita has to different people.
Dada Ravi , you will be surprised how many don’t share you view that the Nazi use of the swastika was eval.
http://www.intelinet.org/swastika/swastika_intro.htm
this site says a lot about the history of the swastika from a rational point of view!
I have written a novel: THE SWASTIKA STAR, in 2004, in norwegian, published in Norway, about the long history of the swastika, and the novel also adresses swastika-related topics as the ill fate of mother nature nowadays and sex. I am looking for a german, english, spanish, french or greek PUBLISHER. The novel even describes the Katrina Hurricane of 2005 one year before it happened! My e-mail-adress is berbez@yahoo.no and my name is Bertrand Besigye. I am an awarded writer in Norway.
Seppo Lehto official pro svastika man is going to participate parliamentary elections in 3 month 2007 in Finland
http://hakaristi.blogspot.com greetings to you all
Thanks Tinny Ray for your interesting posting linking the use of the swastika and the arm salute to 19th Century USA. The links, too, were very interesting, especially the photos showing the american school children using a straight-arm salute to the flag. Your suggestion that the continued ritual of saluting the US flag today has turned americans from being “libertarians” to “authoritarians”, was also interesting, if not, something of a generalisation.
Of course, saluting a flag in itself is not necessarily a problem. I would suggest that it depends entirely on what that flag and the ritual connected to it represents. If it is used in support of an ideology or regime that is tyrannical, oppressive and exploitative, then the practice is negative. If the ideology represented by the flag is universal, moral and committed to humanist (and neo-humanist) ideals, then the saluting of the flag can be a very powerful and positive practice.
Of course, with a few rare exceptions, we all accept that the nazi salute of flag and fuhrer, falls within the negative
expression of this ancient practice.
Dear Friends,
After going through lot of sites (also the link provided by Brian), My knowledge & understanding of swastika has evolved tremendously.Here in my land of origin of swastika ,I consulted lots of scholars & came to the conclussion that the orientation of swastika is merely an illusion created by few of ignorant people.The real significance of swastika doesn’t lies in it’s pros or cons or use by any community worldwide but the scientific significance it carries.In any of the form the swastika always represents a +ve outlook to life &/or group,sect or individual.
Hope to get a +ve feedback from u all.
Thanks Brian for your wonderful insight into the matter of orientation.we are looking forward to explore the links sent by you.
HAPPY NEW YEAR 2007…………… to U all
This is addressed to McIntyre: Regarding the Nazis, you have been duped by neo-nazis and others who post to Wikipedia. You should not cite an anonymous bulletin board. By citing the anonymous bulletin board, you are duped into never using the actual name of the group you discuss: the National Socialist German Workers’ Party. It makes people think that you do not know that there was no “Nazi Party” and that they did not call themselves that, and it is behavior similar to many on Wikipedia who cover-up for what the Nazis actually called themselves (they did NOT call themselves Nazis). Also, the anonymous bulletin board duped you into making readers wonder if you know that German National Socialists did not call their symbol a “Swastika.” Your comments suggest that you are unaware of the amazing discoveries by the historian Dr. Rex Curry concerning swastika symbolism. Your comments about the Aryan word have no support because there is none to cite as shown by the anonymous bulletin board. By citing it you commit the same error in that you fail to mention even once in passing that German National Socialists believed that their socialism was part of their “superior” society or race (what you call their Aryan fixation). That leads to your failure to even mention the use by German Socialists of the swastika as alphabetic symbolism of overlapping “S” letters for their “socialism.” Thus even your early quote from the notorious book by the German Socialist leader shows that he altered the swastika to use it a alphabetic symbolism, because when he used the term Aryan, he included in that term his fanatical dogma – his self-described socialism – a word you never even mention in his regard.
If you want to “rescue” the swastika from German National Socialism, stop repeating wikipedia’s Nazi propaganda about Aryan ideas that attempt to tie the swastika into India etc. You never address the fact that the German National Socialist leader knew early on that the swastika could point either direction and that it was, in Germany, usually flat on one side. It is clear that at some point, he oriented future uses to highlight the “S” orientation and he turned it 45 degrees to the horizontal also, for alphabetic symbolism. All of this you miss because you rely on an anonymous bulletin board.
Swastikas symbols as alphabetic symbolism originated in the USA where it was adopted later by the Nazis.
Nazis adopted the modern swastika symbol as overlapping S letter symbolism for “socialism,” as shown in the research of the noted historian Dr. Rex Curry.
It had also been used as S symbolism for socialism by the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
http://rexcurry.net/ussr-socialist-swastika-cccp-sssr.html
Many people do not know that the term “Nazi” means “National Socialist German Workers’ Party” and that members of the horrid group did not call themselves Nazis, but called themselves socialists.
Swastikas as alphabetic symbolism began in the USA as early as 1875 and continued through the creation of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party (German Nazis or NSGWP).
http://rexcurry.net/theosophy-madame-blavatsky-theosophical-society.html
Also see http://rexcurry.net/45th-infantry-division-swastika-sooner-soldiers.html
The NSGWP had clear roots in National Socialism promoted by socialists in the USA.
The USA also originated flag fetishism, robotic group-chanting to flags, Nazi salutes, and Nazism.
The “Nazi salute” is more accurately called the “American salute” as it was created and popularized by national socialists in the USA where its use was mandated by law in government schools for three decades before, and through, the creation of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party. It was the early gesture of the Pledge of Allegiance.
http://rexcurry.net/book1a1contents-pledge.html
The original pledge was anti libertarian and began with a military salute that then stretched out toward the flag. In actual use, the second part of the gesture was performed with a straight arm and palm down by children casually performing the forced ritual chanting. Due to the way that both gestures were used sequentially in the pledge, the military salute led to the Nazi salute. The Nazi salute is an extended military salute via the USA’s pledge.
The Pledge’s early salute caused quite a Fuhrer/furor. The dogma behind the Pledge was the same dogma that led to the socialist Wholecaust (of which the Holocaust was a part): 62 million slaughtered under the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics; 49 million under the Peoples’ Republic of China; 21 million under the National Socialist German Workers’ Party. It was the worst slaughter of humanity ever.
The USA is still the worst example in the world of bizarre laws that require robotic chanting to a national flag in government schools (socialist schools) every day for 12 years. It has changed generations of Americans from libertarians to authoritarians. The government bamboozled individuals into believing that robotic group-chanting in government schools is a beautiful expression of freedom. Frightening photographs are at http://rexcurry.net/pledge2.html
I have accumulated tons of facts on the swastika and its origins at http://destinationom.typepad.com/omswastika
To clarify the right and left facing arguments…Buddhist, Jains, Hindus, and other religions alike have used the Swastika in both the left and right facing manner (unlike some people that chose to believe that Hitler reversed it to right facing to have it mean the opposite of all that is good in the universe) The left and right facing are often called the feminine and male aspects of the divine symbol.
The swastika used in Buddhist art and scripture is known as a manji (whirlwind), and represents Dharma, universal harmony, and the balance of opposites. It is derived from the Hindu religious swastika, but it is not identical in meaning.
The Manji is made up of several elements- a vertical axis representing the joining of heaven and earth, a horizontal axis representing the connection of yin and yang, and the four arms, representing movement- the whirling force created by the interaction of these elements.
When facing left, it is the Omote (front facing) Manji, representing love and mercy. Facing right, it represents strength and intelligence, and is called the Ura (rear facing) Manji.
I hope this helps to clarify for some of you.
Yes Tinny …… You are absolutely right that it is very difficult to imagine the correct orientation.Altough I have seen use of both the versions in many situations but was speculating whether either of them have any negative effects on our personal lives.I know it may sound somewhat non-scientific but again you actually come to know it’s real significance in terms of it’s acceptance world wide throughout the ages.
The Communist Zionists in USSR try to use it , without success as they had no historic claim to the Germanic Swastika. This Swastika was used by the Viking over 1000 years ago. The original Russ had claim as they also sis inherited it from the Vikings.
The Communist regime in Russia originated in USA and was financed by American Jewish organizations and had no historical claim to this symbol.
Tinny Ray Comments:
The other comment about Germany is interesting in that the use of the symbol as alphabetic lettering occurred in the USA (with the the “Sooner Soldiers” and the Theosophical Socialist Society) and in the USSR (Soviet Socialism) before Germany added its own alphabetic symbolism.
It is surprisingly difficult to understand descriptions of the orientation of the swastika symbol. For example, I was unsure what was meant by the phrase “Both vedic (Hindu) and Tantric tradition have the swastika moving anti-clockwise – means the tails are falling behind as if it were moving in the anti-clockwise direction” until the last part “as it has been represented on this website.”
Another way to make it clear is to say “S” letter shapes, similar to what was done in Germany. And another difference in Germany is that they eventually turned the symbol 45 degrees to the horizontal to further highlight the “S” letters.
Both Vedic (Hindu), Tantric, and Buddhist tend to use symbols that are flat on one side (not turned 45 degrees to the horizontal).
In that sense, the German meaning of the swastika symbol changed as with alphabetic lettering of “S” (see work of the historian Dr. Rex Curry).
The symbol in Germany was not called a swastika but was called a “Hakenkreuz†which means “hooked cross” and refers to two pieces across each other.
The other comment about Germany is interesting in that the use of the symbol as alphabetic lettering occurred in the USA (with the the “Sooner Soldiers” and the Theosophical Socialist Society) and in the USSR (Soviet Socialism) before Germany added its own alphabetic symbolism.
http://rexcurry.net/45th-infantry-division-swastika-sooner-soldiers.html
You could think of the alphabetic orientation as an “altered†symbol as it had been deliberately changed with the orientation and the diamond-shaped twisting.
The Zionists have since the war been able to block the use of the Swastika in several countries, their falsified history and hatreds against the Germanic people is the main reason for the ill reputation of the Swastika. One day the truth will be restored and so will the swastika.